TEN THOUSAND YEARS (complete)

[MJPease]

Hello heinzs, Thanks for the input. To expand a little on this conversation. To me the F-word has taken the course of being an emoticon. The emotion of anger for instance is quickly conveyed with one four letter word. The use of it seems to alienate certain groups. It possibly inhibates the poems reading and this makes the use of this emoticon ineffective at times. For instance if I were to do a reading at a school, (High School) The faculty would probably ask me to leave and never return. I'd like to hear from others in the group on this subject.

[She WHAT?!]

Hi. Looks like you're going for a song here. Songs work better when heard, and with the music helping to organize the rhymes. On paper--okay, on computer--you need other things to make it clear how to read it. Punctuation is the most important. Let's take out the line breaks from the first stanza, and you can see the problem:

Neolithic man found encased in ice arrow pearced your heart, heard them say why your life, the price you paid did you die for your God was it greed or some other need whatever it was the message rings clear not much has changed in ten thousand years

The line breaks don't do enough. You need punctuation:

Neolithic man found encased in ice; arrow pearced your heart, heard them say. Why your life, the price you paid--did you die for your God? Was it greed or some other need? Whatever it was, the message rings clear. Not much has changed in ten thousand years.

Now let's put the line breaks back:

Neolithic man found encased in ice;
arrow pearced your heart, heard them say.
Why your life, the price you paid--
did you die for your God?
Was it greed or some other need?
Whatever it was, the message rings clear.
Not much has changed in ten thousand years.

Much easier to read.

As for the poem overall, I would say: watch out for general statements. Make everything specific. You have done that with most of it, but sometimes it gets too abstract.

"What the mind of man can conceive..." is very general, but you then give specifics, like the wheel, etc. That's good. Another example is when you mention armies, and list some specific armies. That's the way to do it.

There were three importants places where you didn't use specifics, and it made me yell at my computer, like this:

astral travelers please help me to see
what the fuck is bothering me [Well? What the fuck is bothering you?]
what have we learned in ten thousand years
live longer, move faster, the same old fears [Fears? What fears? What are you whining about?]

My religion? Your religion? Who is to blame? [Blame for what?]

Whenever you're specific, about the astronauts and war and stuff, you do make good points. So watch out for those spots where you leave it vague.

As for the word "fuck"--unnecessary melodrama. You are going to have to strengthen that part with specifics anyway. When you have done that, you won't need the word anymore.

Cheers,
Eliana

[MJPease]

Thank You She WHAT?!, I guess your right. I may have been going for a song here. I'm pathetic at punctuation and I see your point. You have taken time to explain in great detail and I appreciate your efforts as I usally do. This piece would turn into a novel if I got to specific about what is bothering me. I'm going to heed your advice and examine this to no end. The song version is something I would very much like to have come to fruition. I'm going to look up a few of your pieces and see how you yourself utilize punctuation, maybe you could send me directly to the best examples. Who knows Eliana maybe You can teach this Old Dog some new tricks Thanks Again and Take Care

[Richard taylor]

I'll come back to this in a grammar sense it needs revising a little
richard

[MJPease]

Thank You Richard

[She WHAT?!]

I make no claims about my own punctuation. Some of my poems are experimental. But here is a poem that actually used sentences and stuff, so it has some punctuation in it:

http://www.poetrypages.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=27767

[MJPease]

Hello She WHAT?!, I just typed a lengthy reply here and it disappeared That will teach me to sit here with a guitar in hand while I type. Talk of biting off more than you can chew. I'll get back to this later. Take care

[Richard taylor]

Well Michael you have a bunch of replies so just a few
Grammar words to help it flow better punctuation is my
Weakness. And some spelling i.e.
Hope this helps good poem.
TRAVELLERS
MERLIN’S
STONEHENGE
PIERCED
ACHIEVE

TEN THOUSAND YEARS

Neolithic man found encased in ice
arrow pierced your heart, heard them say!!!Arrow pierced his heart I heard them say!!!
Why your life, the price you paid !!! His life the price he paid!!!
Did you die for your God
was it greed or some other need
whatever it was the message rings clear
not much has changed in ten thousand years

What the mind of man can conceive
he so can achieve, I've heard them say!!! Then he can achieve I’ve heard them say!!!
A major deal, when the wheel came into play!!! And when the wheel came into play!!!l
great pyramids, chariots of the gods some say
Stonehenge Merlin’s magical creation, maybe!! “Maybe” stops me a bit here looks fragmented!!!
We’ll decode the human genome some day
not much has changed in ten thousand years

We live longer, grow taller, shed the same tears
controlled atmosphere, and built the chip!!! Controlling the atmosphere creating the chip!!!
Ignored Mother Nature while on this trip
defied gravity, broke the speed of sound!!! Deifying gravity breaking the speed of sound!!!
Split the atom, built great towns!!! Splitting the atom building great towns!!!!
Built tall buildings, just to knock them down!!! Building!!!
Not much has changed in ten thousand years

Set foot on the moon for all humankind!! A boom for mankind!!!
That should give us some great peace of mind
astral travellers please help me to see
what the fuck is bothering me
what have we learned in ten thousand years
live longer, move faster, the same old fears
not much has changed in ten thousand years

My religion? Your religion? Who is to blame?
Great armies of the Romans, Saxons and Danes
they fought and died but never in vain
good against evil, it's Gods will they say
great warriors in battle again present day
when the smoke clears and the battle is done
not much has changed in ten thousand years

MJPease 3/07/2002

The Earth The Son and The Moon

[MJPease]

Hello Richard, I've thought about your suggested or proposed changes. It has dawned on me that this piece since already published is unchangable. It is in Poetry Pages/ A collection Of Voices from around the world Vol. 1 The only work I've decided to do with this. From all the help the critique group has offered is add some music to it. Take Care

[heinzs]

Michael, even though it's published, it can always be altered and revised as a "new version". Even the classical poets have done so.

H.

[Debbie]

The world is still the same in a sense..
what has changed is the peoples attitudes, our technology,
our way of doing things. I don't think we live longer due to our eating habits though..and the chip sure is here also..
life is still pretty much the same..but I might add..much more costly in to many ways..enviroment, health, and inflation..etc
Nice job on this poem MJ

[MJPease]

Hello heinzs, Thanks for the information. Even if acceptable, I'm not sure if I can do that on a more personal level. I'll have to think more about it. I think version two of this, would be the attempted adaptation to music. I'd be open for all sorts of help in this endeavor. If I remember correctly You're a musician yourself heinzs. Was it accordian? I just remember key board of some type. There is a great qoute I vaguely remember about the merging of Poetry and Music. I wish I could find it and if I do. I will post it. Take Care

[snorple]

I thought it was very good, for a duck. The ice man has made us think about our ancesters, and some things never change about our humanity. I think we have stopped smelling posterias however, dogs keep it up because they can smell 100 times better than us so I suppose they get a lot more out of the experience.

[snorple]

Some things never change, we have parents who fall in love, and copulate and we are born. Or they don't fall in love but copulate then we are born. We live for some time then we die.

In between birth and death we experience agony, pain, hurt, pleasure, love, proceate, suffer, lots of things.

Ten thousand years ago we could be eaten by bears, struck down with some disease and most people died around 50 or less. Now we have all kinds of medicines and surgical proceedures that cure us and enable us to live a reaonable standard of life. The big broblem is death, we all have to die, we put it off for years and then we realise the days are getting shorter and the nights longer so to speak, out life force is running out. If we have a family it may be a loving affair, dying. Sometime people die alone, unloved and in agony not much has changed in that respect. Our culture and society has much more pleasure I guess than ten thousand years ago.

In wars not much has changed, people die, in agony but now in multitude of different ways, there is no easy way out in being killed whether by a blunt bronze sword or a sharp shell fragment it's all pain.

What makes a difference in my opinion is God, if you have God then you have everything. And He will direct yur path. He will tell you what is evil and not what to do to live. And if you follow God you will avoid some terrible life choices that are now promoted by modern society. Yet God never changes neither does his law.

I think the poem is saying that nothing changes, and that is true in many ways, and yet everything has changed, yet some things remain the same.

Nice poem

snorple

[MJPease]

Hello snorple, Sorry it took me a couple of years to say thanks for responding. Take Care